What if the British Royal Navy was allowed to keep the two power standard and build 3 more battlecruisers and 2 more battleships?

[NOMISYRRUC]

The first sentence of the OP.

What if the Washington naval treaty of 1922 had allowed the British Royal Navy to keep its prior two power standard and build the Nelson class battleships and complete the rest of the admiral class (HMS Hood’s class) rather than have the same amount of capital ships as the American Navy?

In continuation with what I wrote in Posts 59, 66 and 80 . . . this is effectively a "Royal Navy 1919-39 - Money no Object" thread or at the very least the last "Larger Interwar RN" thread on steroids.

Optimize the RN for WWII

Congratulations you've been made 3rd Sea Lord at the beginning of 1923 and will hold the post till the beginning of 1939. Your objective is to optimize the RN especially its new designs and refits of existing ships for WWII. Assume you get around a 10 to 15% larger budget than otl and slightly...

www.alternatehistory.com

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

The first sentence of the OP.

What if the Washington naval treaty of 1922 had allowed the British Royal Navy to keep its prior two power standard and build the Nelson class battleships and complete the rest of the admiral class (HMS Hood’s class) rather than have the same amount of capital ships as the American Navy?

As written before . . .

1) As other's have written, it wouldn't have happened, but I'll play along as a thought experiment.​

2) As other's have written, it wouldn't have happened, but I'll play along as a thought experiment.​

And.​

3) As other's have written, it wouldn't have happened, but I'll play along as a thought experiment.​

More background information about British defence spending in the 16 financial years from 1st April 1921 to 31st March 1936 . . .

• £189.4 million spent on defence in the 1921-22 financial year, which consisted of . . .
  • £95.1 million spent on the Army.
  • £13.6 million spent on the Air Force.
    • And.
  • £80.8 million spent on the Navy.
• £113.6 million was on average spent on defence in the 14 financial years 1922-23 to 1935-36. This was £75.8 million (40.0%) less than 1921-22 and consisted on an average of . . .
  • £41.7 million spent on the Army, which was £53.5 million a year (56.2%) less than 1921-22.
  • £16.2 million spent on the Air Force. which was £2.6 million (19.5%) more than 1921-22.
    • And.
  • £55.8 million spent on the Navy, which was £25.0 million (30.1%) less than 1921-22.
• The £186.1 million spent on defence in the 1936-37 financial year. Thus total defence expenditure had returned to 1921-22 levels (because it was only £3.4 million (1.8%) less than in 1921-22) and consisted of . . .
  • £54.8 million spent on the Army, which was still £40.3 million (42.3%) less than 1921-22.
  • £50.1 million spent on the Air Force, which was £36.6 million (269.7%) more than 1921-22.
    • And.
  • £81.1 million spent on the Navy, which was £0.3 million (0.4%) more than 1921-22 or in other words virtually the same as 1921-22.
    • Therefore . . .
  • Between the 1921-22 financial year and the 1936-37 financial year the Air Force had effectively been given priority over the Army.

IOTL full-scale rearmament began in the 1936-37 financial year. This was when the RAF's Expansion Scheme F was begun and the RN's building programme for the year included 7 Submarines, 2 Aircraft Carriers (Illustrious & Victorious), 2 Battleships (King George V & Prince of Wales), 7 Cruisers (Edinburgh, Belfast & the first 5 Dido class) and 16 Destroyers (9 Tribal & 8 J class).

ITTL the British Government (due to a change in economic policy and with sufficient support from the British Electorate) maintained revenue and spending at 1921-22 levels for the 14 financial years 1922-23 to 1935-36.

This included maintaining total defence spending at an average of £189.4 million a year instead of reducing it to £113.6 million a year. However, spending on the Army, Air Force and Navy wasn't the same as in 1921-22 because less was spend on the Army while more was spent on the Air Force and Navy. That is . . .

• £56.7 million on the Army, which was £15.0 million (36.0%) more than what was spend in the period 1922-23 to 1935-36 IOTL.
  • Most of this extra money was used to quintuple spending on Armaments and Warlike Stores.
• £32.4 million on the Air Force, which was double what was spent in the period 1922-23 to 1935-36 IOTL.
  • And.
• £100.4 million on the Navy, which was £44.6 million (79.9%) more than was spent in the period 1922-23 to 1935-36 IOTL. It was also . . .
  • £19.6 million (24.3%) more than what was spent on the Navy in the 1921-22 financial year in both timelines.
    • And.
  • £19.3 million (23.8%) more than what was spend on the Navy in the 1936-37 financial year IOTL.

So ITTL spending on the RN in the period 1922-36 was 80% more than what was spent IOTL. This was the period when the tonnage quotas were in force (1922-36 for aircraft carriers & capital ships and 1930-36 for submarines cruisers % destroyers). However, the TTL versions of the Washington & First London Naval Treaties allowed the British Empire & Commonwealth to have 100% more submarines, 60% more aircraft carriers & capital ships, 57% more cruisers and 70% more destroyers than IOTL.

 

[HexWargamer]

Financing the UK National Dept ...
I was always given to understand a lot of the UK National Debt was owed to the Americans (ww1 debt) & UK relied on German Reperations (and payments from other European conntries to whom UK lent during ww1) to finance the US debt.
From 1930 onwards the Great Depression hits & in mid 1931, the Hoover Moratorium suspends war debt repayments .. is this the reduction we see in British National Debt servicing costs ??
In USA, in March 1933 President Roosevelt convinces Congress to pass the Emergency Banking Act. It ends the right of the American citizen to convert dollar notes into gold coin. Over the next year holding gold will become illegal. Then, on February 2nd 1934 , USA price of gold is changed from $20.67 per ounce to $35 per ounce. In short it's a devaluatin of the $ by 40% !!
I would expect this to have a similar effect on the UK cost of servicing $ denominated war debt (i.e cost is reduced by 40%) since the UK doesn't match the US devaluation with it's own ???

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

The first sentence of the OP.

What if the Washington naval treaty of 1922 had allowed the British Royal Navy to keep its prior two power standard and build the Nelson class battleships and complete the rest of the admiral class (HMS Hood’s class) rather than have the same amount of capital ships as the American Navy?

Please note the following:

1) As other's have written, it wouldn't have happened, but I'll play along as a thought experiment.​

2) As other's have written, it wouldn't have happened, but I'll play along as a thought experiment.​

And.​

3) As other's have written, it wouldn't have happened, but I'll play along as a thought experiment.​

Link to Post 55 on Page 3 which was "PART 1. Capital Ships Which May Be Retained By The Contracting Powers" from the OTL Treaty.

FWIW ITTL

The displacements for the ships with the red triangle in the top right corner are the load displacements according to Conway's 1906-21​

The OTL Washington Naval Treaty allowed the British Empire to retain 22 Capital Ships of 580,450 tons, which was reduced to 20 Capital Ships of 558,950 tons when Nelson & Rodney were completed & Thunderer, King George V, Ajax and Centurion were scrapped. Both totals were more then the 525,000 tons of Capital Ships that the Treaty allowed the British Empire to build 1931-42. Both totals were also more than the corresponding 500,650 tons and 525,850 tons that the United States were allowed to retain.

The TTL Washington Naval Treaty allowed the British Empire to retain 36 Capital Ships of 887,020 tons, which was reduced to 32 Capital Ships of the 863,270 tons when the four Nelson class built and Agincourt, Colossus, Hercules, Neptune, Collingwood, St Vincent, Australia & New Zealand were scrapped. Both totals were more than the 840,000 tons of Capital Ships that the Treaty Allowed the British Empire to build 1931-42. Both totals were also more than the corresponding 801,970 and 827,170 tons that the United States & Japan were allowed to retain.

Nos. 29 to 36 in the list were the 8 newest 12in gunned dreadnoughts and as already related were to be scrapped when the 4 ships of Nelson class were completed. The 32 ships that the TTL version of the Treaty allowed the British Empire to keep after the Nelson class was completed consisted of 4 with 16in guns, 13 with 15in guns and 15 with 13.5in guns. The latter consisted of the all the 13.5in gunned ships that had survived the Great War, whereas IOTL six (Lion, Princess Royal, Conqueror, Monarch, Orion & Erin) had to be scrapped immediately and four (King George V, Ajax, Centurion & Thunderer) had to be scrapped when Nelson & Rodney were completed which left five (the 4 Iron Dukes & Tiger).

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

The first sentence of the OP.

What if the Washington naval treaty of 1922 had allowed the British Royal Navy to keep its prior two power standard and build the Nelson class battleships and complete the rest of the admiral class (HMS Hood’s class) rather than have the same amount of capital ships as the American Navy?

Please note the following:

1) As other's have written, it wouldn't have happened, but I'll play along as a thought experiment.​

2) As other's have written, it wouldn't have happened, but I'll play along as a thought experiment.​

And.​

3) As other's have written, it wouldn't have happened, but I'll play along as a thought experiment.​

FWIW this is the Capital Ship Replacement Schedule for the British Empire in the OTL Treaty
It's also in Post 28 on Page 2 with the Replacement Schedules for the USA and Japan

And FWIW this is what I think the Replacement Schedule for the British Empire in the TTL Treaty would have been

​

The OTL Treaty allowed the British Empire and USA to have 3 Post-Jutland ships each. However, the only Post-Jutland ship the British Empire had in 1922 was Hood, which is why it was allowed to build Nelson & Rodney. The TTL Treaty allowed the British Empire to have 5 Post-Jutland ships to match the 3 possessed by the USA and 2 possessed by Japan. However, as IOTL the only Post-Jutland ship the British Empire had in 1922 was Hood which is why it was allowed to build 4 Nelson class ships instead of 2. The OTL Treaty allowed the British Empire to keep 4 old ships until Nelson & Rodney were completed which is why the TTL version of the Treaty allows the British Empire to keep 8 old ships until Nelson & Rodney were completed.

The OTL Treaty allowed the British Empire to lay down fifteen 35,000 ton Capital Ships 1931-39 at the rate of about two ships a year to match the 15 ships that the USA was allowed to lay down over the same period. The TTL Treaty allowed the British Empire to lay down twenty-four 35,000 ton Capital Ships 1931-39 at the rate of about 3 ships a year to match the 24 ships (15 + 9) that the USA & Japan were allowed to lay down over the same period.

In the OTL Replacement Schedule the 5 ships laid down 1931-33 replaced 10 ships and the 10 ships laid down 1934-39 replaced 10 ships. That's why the 8 ships laid down 1931-33 in the TTL version replace 16 ships (which happen to be all fifteen 13.5in gunned ships and Queen Elizabeth) and the 16 ships laid down 1934-39 in the TTL version replace 16 ships.

The OTL Treaty allowed the British Empire to retain Colossus & Collingwood for non-combat purposes, which it didn't. However, the pre-dreadnought Agamemnon was used as a radio-controlled target ship until the late 1920s when it was replaced by Centurion and the First London Naval Treaty allowed Iron Duke to be converted to a gunnery training ship instead of being scrapped.

The TTL Treaty allowed the British Empire to retain the older 12in gunned dreadnoughts Bellerophon & Superb for non-combat purposes because IOTL Colossus & Collingwood were to be retained until 1925 when the Nelson class was completed. However, the ships (which were to be scrapped immediately under the OTL Treaty) were probably scrapped because Colossus & Collingwood weren't retained for non-combat purposes IOTL and therefore I don't see Bellerophon & Superb being retained for non-combat purposes ITTL.

OTOH the OTL Treaty also allowed the USA & Japan to keep 2 ships for non-combat purposes and as the TTL Treaty gave the British Empire parity with the USA & Japan instead of the USA only the TTL may have allowed the British Empire to keep 4 ships for non-combat duties. If so they would have been Dreadnought & Temeraire or Indomitable & Inflexible. However, in common with the OTL ships and their TTL substitutes they would probably have been scrapped more or less immediately.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

Financing the UK National Debt ...
I was always given to understand a lot of the UK National Debt was owed to the Americans (ww1 debt) & UK relied on German Reparations (and payments from other European conntries to whom UK lent during ww1) to finance the US debt.
From 1930 onwards the Great Depression hits & in mid 1931, the Hoover Moratorium suspends war debt repayments .. is this the reduction we see in British National Debt servicing costs ??
In USA, in March 1933 President Roosevelt convinces Congress to pass the Emergency Banking Act. It ends the right of the American citizen to convert dollar notes into gold coin. Over the next year holding gold will become illegal. Then, on February 2nd 1934 , USA price of gold is changed from $20.67 per ounce to $35 per ounce. In short it's a devaluation of the $ by 40% !!
I would expect this to have a similar effect on the UK cost of servicing $ denominated war debt (i.e. cost is reduced by 40%) since the UK doesn't match the US devaluation with it's own ???

Unfortunately, I don't know how and why the UK National Debt was refinanced in the early 1930s, only that it was.

However, the reduction in the price of gold that you mentioned occurred 11 months after the cost of servicing the UK National Debt was reduced to £224 million a year from the over £300 million a year that it had been from the end of the Great War to the 1932-33 financial year.