The (Global) South Rises: Collaborative TL

[Mr_ Bondoc]

One thing that has not been done often is an ATL focusing on the Southern Hemisphere. For the purposes of the ATL, the idea is starting in August 1945, have the Southern Hemisphere become a major power bloc. This includes Sub-Saharan Africa, Latin America, South Asia, the Middle East, China and Southeast Asia. The idea is to create a create as different timeline as possible, without making changes to Europe, Canada, Japan, and the United States. The more unique, the better...

 

[Mr_ Bondoc]

Here are a few PODs:

April 18-24, 1955: Bandung Conference; World leaders gather in Bandung, Indonesia led by Sukarno, Jawarhalal Nehru, and Josip Broz Tito and Zhou En-lai call for an global bloc of nations separate from the Soviet, European, and American power blocs,...

July 19, 1956: Brijuni Declaration; leaders of the Global South including Josip Broz Tito, Gamal Abdel Nasser, and Jawarhalal Nehru, call for a unified "Global South" on Brijuni, Yugoslavia,...

September 6, 1961: Global South leaders call for "self-determination " and independence for Puerto Rico, fueling political tensions with the United States,....

June 15, 1964: 77 of the Global South leaders proclaim a power bloc/ alliance in Geneva, Switzerland, proclaiming their independence from the Soviet and Western political blocs,...

December 30, 1964: Global South leaders announce in Geneva, Switzerland, an economic alliance/ free trade agreement uniting the 77 nations of the Global South,...

September 9, 1973: Global South leaders in Algiers, Algeria, call for political independence and "self-determination" for the Western Sahara, fueling political tensions with France, Spain and Great Britain,....

May 1, 1974: Global South leaders proclaim the New International Economic Order (NIEO), calling for political and economic reforms and development at the United Nations General Assembly in New York City, New York,...

March 23, 1976: Global leaders proclaim the New World Information Communication Order (NWICO) is proclaimed by Global South leaders, as a call to expand communications and technological development, at the United Nations in New York City, New York,...

October 22-23, 1981: Cancun Summit; 133 Global leaders from Northern and Southern Hemispheres gather in Cancun, Mexico, in an effort to establish diplomatic and political ties between the power blocs,...

March 12, 1983: New Delhi Proclamation; Global South leaders proclaim in New Delhi that the alliance has served as "history's biggest peace movement ", signaling the unity of the movement,...

December 4, 1986: New International Economic Order (NIEO) is declared a "massive failure" by Global South" who call for a "Right to Development " in New York City, New York,...

November 16, 1990: Lisbon Conference; 133 World leaders gather in Lisbon, Portugal in an effort to forge political and diplomatic ties between the Northern and Southern Hemispheres,....

September 3, 1998: Global South leaders in Durban, South Africa call for major political and structural reforms within the United Nations, including the United Mations Security Conucil (UNSC),...

September 25, 2009: Treaty of Margarita; Southern Hemisphere leaders hold defense conference in Margarita, Venezuela, calling a limited military alliance between Hemisphere leaders,...

 

[British Biscuit]

October 24, 1945: the United Nations Security Council is formed. Victorious powers of WW2 pick 6 nations to be the Permanent Members of UNSC – Brazil, Chiang Kai-shek's China, France, the Soviet Union, United Kingdom, and United States of America. US president Franklin D. Roosevelt championed Brazil's inclusion in UNSC against initial protestations from Churchill and Stalin. Roosevelt argued that Brazil is worthy of membership not only due to the help it provided the Allies in WW2 but also due to its size, population, resources and potential for growth. Ultimately Brazil was chosen for "hemispheric stability", to give Latin America and the Global South a representative on the new body responsible for global peace in hopes of making the organization more stable and effective than the old League of Nations. Not all countries were happy with the arrangement however, as Spanish-speaking Latin American nations argued Brazil did not represent their interests...

 

[Mr_ Bondoc]

Just out of curiosity, should the Global South have nuclear weapons? China, India, Pakistan, Iran, Argentina, Brazil, and South Africa all have demonstrated an ability to obtain nuclear arms...

 

[lukedalton]

Honestly seem extremely difficult if not totally impossible seeing the global south becoming a powerfull power bloc; 3 o 4 different regional block plus China? Yes, something more unified and especially during the cold war? Almost impossible, we are talking of region that have in common only being in the 'global south', hell even the attempt of form a more unified arab state were abysmal failure due to the difference between the various nation.

Take China, she had split with Russia because she don't want to play second fiddle to Russia and surely will not even entertain the notion that Brasil and India are on her level for any leadership of the block now repeat this so many times for all the various new nations; after that we must talk about how many of them are not very stable dictatorships, how having the arabs mean being involved in the conflict with Israel or having India mean resolving the Kashmir question (among others) in a way or another.

Take for example your PoD of September 9, 1973, France and Uk will not give a damn, Spain will take offense but it's thinking already to leave the place, the only one really irked by the declaration are Morocco and Mauritania that had a lot of plan regarding dividing that territory between them and at the time (Morocco even now) want Western Sahara independence like a bullet in the knee.

or for Pod June 15, 1964...are they also independent by their money, because a lot of that nation need it as they also need their technical help and all this come always with string attached in the cold war.

 

[Mr_ Bondoc]

Honestly seem extremely difficult if not totally impossible seeing the global south becoming a powerfull power bloc; 3 o 4 different regional block plus China? Yes, something more unified and especially during the cold war? Almost impossible, we are talking of region that have in common only being in the 'global south', hell even the attempt of form a more unified arab state were abysmal failure due to the difference between the various nation.

Take China, she had split with Russia because she don't want to play second fiddle to Russia and surely will not even entertain the notion that Brasil and India are on her level for any leadership of the block now repeat this so many times for all the various new nations; after that we must talk about how many of them are not very stable dictatorships, how having the arabs mean being involved in the conflict with Israel or having India mean resolving the Kashmir question (among others) in a way or another.

Take for example your PoD of September 9, 1973, France and Uk will not give a damn, Spain will take offense but it's thinking already to leave the place, the only one really irked by the declaration are Morocco and Mauritania that had a lot of plan regarding dividing that territory between them and at the time (Morocco even now) want Western Sahara independence like a bullet in the knee.

or for Pod June 15, 1964...are they also independent by their money, because a lot of that nation need it as they also need their technical help and all this come always with string attached in the cold war.

I would like to think that it is entirely possible, just not very simple, and certainly not under utopian execution. But it is certainly possible to see economic and political improvement . As to whether there will be some ugliness and tragedy, that is certainly guaranteed, especially with the Sino-Indian Split, but also because of the complete opposition to the State of Israel. But with over 1/2 of the world's population in the alliance, I can see some interesting developments to the TL...

 

[lukedalton]

I would like to think that it is entirely possible, just not very simple, and certainly not under utopian execution. But it is certainly possible to see economic and political improvement . As to whether there will be some ugliness and tragedy, that is certainly guaranteed, especially with the Sino-Indian Split, but also because of the complete opposition to the State of Israel. But with over 1/2 of the world's population in the alliance, I can see some interesting developments to the TL...

Many of this country really don't like each other...and i use an euphemism, have a lot of different interest, different type of economies; as i said you can have regional bloc, like OTL Mercosur, the Africa Union can become like the EEC and later EU, some arab project of unified state can have success and both China and India can have their group of pupp...ehm sorry allied nations but the space filling empire that you envision is ASB regardless of PoD unless you mean something like the Movement of non-aligned nation that's for all pratical issue a place for nation to make statement and have diplomatic contact but nothing less, basically a poor man version of the UN.

Basically the more member you have and the more complicated the work of an organization become, look at the EU and are all nation that had worked together for decades and have so many ties and link that you can't even count

 

[Mr_ Bondoc]

Many of this country really don't like each other...and i use an euphemism, have a lot of different interest, different type of economies; as i said you can have regional bloc, like OTL Mercosur, the Africa Union can become like the EEC and later EU, some arab project of unified state can have success and both China and India can have their group of pupp...ehm sorry allied nations but the space filling empire that you envision is ASB regardless of PoD unless you mean something like the Movement of non-aligned nation that's for all pratical issue a place for nation to make statement and have diplomatic contact but nothing less, basically a poor man version of the UN.

Basically the more member you have and the more complicated the work of an organization become, look at the EU and are all nation that had worked together for decades and have so many ties and link that you can't even count

Trust me, as with the Communist Bloc, which split within 8 years of its creation, and within 20 years was at war with itself. But to the rest of the world, even into the age of glasnost and perestroika, most Americans saw the Communist bloc as a unified bloc. What I see happening is an alliance that creates a facade of control and unity, and demonstrates its unity on some rare votes.

 

[Whiteshore]

August 15, 1947: India gains independence as a single unpartitioned country with C. Rajagopalachari as its first Prime Minister and Jawaharlal Nehru as the Foreign Minister of India.

 

[Mr_ Bondoc]

Here are a few PODs to continue changing the TL:

September 1, 1967: Khartoum Declaration; Global South leaders launch an oil embargo against Israel, citing its actions against Palestinian and Lebanese people, during a conference in Khartoum, fueling accusations of anti-Semitism...

July 4, 1969: Global South leaders condemn the Warsaw Pact and Soviet crackdown on Czechoslovakia before the United Nations General Assembly in New York City, New York,...

December 21, 1971: Carlos Ortiz de Rozas of Argentina is named United Nations Secretary-General in New York City, after it is revealed that Kurt Waldheim of Austria, served with the Nazi Party during the Second World War, ...

November 10, 1975: Global South leaders unite in support of a resolution condemning Israeli Zionism as "racism", before the United Nations General Assembly in New York City, New York,...

December 3, 1986: KGB Yevgeny Primakov launches Operation INFEKTION, promoting the idea in the Global South, starting in Mumbai, India, that the AIDS/ HIV virus was created by the U.S. military, fueling distrust for American and European trade,...

December 15, 1988: Global South leaders call for the political recognition and independence for Palestine, before the United Nations in New York City, sparking accusations of anti-Semitism,...

February 13, 2003: Global Global South leaders gathered in Porto Alegre, Brazil condemn American and Israeli military actions in the Middle East, fueling tensions in the region,...

January 31, 2005: Porto Alegre Manifesto; Global South leaders led by Immanuel Wallerstein, Tariq Ali, Aminata Traore, and Emir Sader (a.k.a. " Group of 19") publish an anti-globalization political manifesto in Porto Alegre, Brazil,...

May 4, 2020: Porlamar Conference; Global South leaders gather in Porlamar, Venezuela to coordinate strategies and research in order to deal with the COVID-19/ coronavirus outbreak,...

 

[Mr_ Bondoc]

Here are a few more changes to flag the changes:

April 28, 1996: Global South leaders in Midrand, South Africa condemn American and European policies of commercial globalization, fueling economic tensions worldwide,...

October 21, 1999: Global South leaders gathered in Penang, Malaysia, call for a moratorium on genetically modified organisms (GMOs) and bans on patents,...

December 8, 2000: Manila Declaration; Global South leaders call for sustainable development policies and the protection of indigenous peoples, during a summit in Manila, Philippines,...

February 13, 2001: Global South leaders led by Roberto Bissio proclaim the "right to development "/ "right to not be poor", citing the "extreme poverty" suffered by the Global South in Geneva, Switzerland,...

September 2, 2002: Global South leaders gathered in Doha Qatar, denounce the World Trade Organization (WTO) over its use of mandatory genetically modified (GM) foods to Sub-Saharan Africa,....

May 30, 2006: Global South leaders led by Martin Khor meet in Putrajaya, Malaysia, demanding the need for political and economic structural reformation of the United Nations,...

September 23, 2010: Global South leaders led by Kanaga Raja denounce Israeli military actions in the Gaza Strip, claiming that it is tantamount to colonialism and apartheid,...

March 14, 2014: Global South leaders led by Kanaga Raja proclaim food as a "human right" in Geneva, Switzerland, fueling political tensions between the Northern and Southern Hemispheres,....

 

[Mr_ Bondoc]

Just out of curiosity, what should happen to Australia and New Zealand, especially considering that they are definitely in Southern Hemisphere, yet are not considered parts of the "Global South"?

 

[Mr_ Bondoc]

@Gillan1220 , @Samsara123 , @Simeon - Here is a POD to flag that Southeast Asia will be different, I want to thank you guys for the idea:

August 26, 1963: U.S. President John F. Kennedy announces a qualified support for the Greater Malayan Federation, during a series of phone calls from the White House in Washington D.C., in an effort to limit Communist infiltration and influence in Southeast Asia,. .

August 29, 1963: Indonesia, Malaysia, and Indonesia announce the formation of the Greater Malaysian Federation (a.k.a. "Maphilindo") in Jakarta, promising a centralized democratic constitution and government, with Manila serving as the primary trade hub,...

See: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maphilindo

 

[Gillan1220]

@Gillan1220 , @Samsara123 , @Simeon - Here is a POD to flag that Southeast Asia will be different, I want to thank you guys for the idea:

August 26, 1963: U.S. President John F. Kennedy announces a qualified support for the Greater Malayan Federation, during a series of phone calls from the White House in Washington D.C., in an effort to limit Communist infiltration and influence in Southeast Asia,. .

August 29, 1963: Indonesia, Malaysia, and Indonesia announce the formation of the Greater Malaysian Federation (a.k.a. "Maphilindo") in Jakarta, promising a centralized democratic constitution and government, with Manila serving as the primary trade hub,...

See: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maphilindo

So this some sort of Pan-Southeast Asian movement?

 

[Mr_ Bondoc]

So this some sort of Pan-Southeast Asian movement?

Well, it is at least the merger of Malay cultures into a super-state roughly the same size of the United States...

 

[Gillan1220]

Well, it is at least the merger of Malay cultures into a super-state roughly the same size of the United States...View attachment 643029

Will this bloc eventually absorb Brunei, Singapore, East Timor, and PNG?

 

[Mr_ Bondoc]

Will this bloc eventually absorb Brunei, Singapore, East Timor, and PNG?

I don't think it will formally annex them (except possibly for Singapore), but rather serve as an example for Cambodia, Laos, and Vietnam, much like France and Germany over the 14 nations of the European Union..

 

[Gillan1220]

I don't think it will formally annex them (except possibly for Singapore), but rather serve as an example for Cambodia, Laos, and Vietnam, much like France and Germany over the 14 nations of the European Union..

Singapore is too valuable for the Maphilindo to just be let out.

 

[Mr_ Bondoc]

Singapore is too valuable for the Maphilindo to just be let out.

Pretty much, but also part of the reason they will constantly at odds with China. Also consider that this will fuel jealousy from Japan and other Asian nations...

 

[Mr_ Bondoc]

Here are a few PODs to flag that Sub-Saharan Africa is different, and more unified in the TL:

May 7, 1961: Casablanca Bloc; African leaders led by Ghanian President Kwame Nkrumah and Moroccan leader Mohammed V, proclaim the establishment of a political alliance of nations aimed at political union of the African continent at Casablanca, Morocco,...

May 12, 1961: Monrovia Bloc; African leaders led by Egyptian President Gamal Abdel-Nasser and Senegalese President Leopold Sedar Senghor,call for a political alliance of African nations in Monrovia, Liberia,...

May 25, 1963: Organization for African Unity (OAU) is established in Addis Ababa, Ethiopia, with the leadership of 33 nations led by Ghanaian President Kwame Nkrumah, despite diplomatic and political pressure by France and Great Britain,...

November 12, 1984: Morocco threatens to leave the Organization of African Unity (OAU) in Addis Ababa, Ethiopia; Global South leaders accuse the United States and France of attempting to break up the 5,...

October 22, 1986: African Commission on Human and Peoples' Rights (ACHPR) is established in Addis Ababa, Ethiopia, actively condemning the South African apartheid policies,...

July 9, 2002: African Union (AU) proclaims the political and economic alliance of the continent in Addis Ababa, Ethiopia, led by South African President Thabo Mbeki, sparking tensions with Europe,...

October 22, 2008: African Free Trade Zone (AFTZ) is established in Cape Town, South Africa, sparking an economic boom for the African continent, focusing on manufacturing and technological development,...

March 23, 2021: Suez Canal Crisis; African Union President Roger Nkodo Dang of Cameroon, calls for the sealing of the Suez Canal, citing the arbitrary distribution of the COVID-19/ coronavirus vaccine,...