The Anglo/American - Nazi War

[Wendigo]

How extensive/successful was the Nazi indoctrination of non Germans in Europe?

Were there Hitler Youth programs and the like in the Balkans and Western Europe?

 

[Tsar of New Zealand]

How extensive/successful was the Nazi indoctrination of non Germans in Europe?

Were there Hitler Youth programs and the like in the Balkans and Western Europe?

Well, it sure as hell seemed to work in France.

 

[Drunken_Soviet]

When the real gee wizz stuff is subtracted the military forces are actually weaker in a lot of areas than IOTL. There is less need for SAM systems, nothing is going to stop the A4 weapons, and since you can't really wage an international war of aggression there isn't much need for mobile SAMs. Stealth isn't really a thing, the concept is understood, but when the other guy own the orbitals and the Moon, it isn't going to do a lot for you. India and the A4 have Gen 4++ aircraft, India has developed the tech for Gen 5, but there really isn't the need to spend three times as much per airframe when the non A4 countries are very much second string and the A4 operates Trans-Orbital hypersonic bombers that are gone before you realize they are there.

Overall ground systems are in the mid-late 80s while naval forces have shrunk considerably with the movement of A4 deterrent to the orbitals and the Moon. what is left is enough for some heavy peacekeeping (the U.S. had four CVN on patrol readiness, with three others cycling through Complex refueling/Modernization at all times, the RN has a couple decks, Canada and Australia are nursing along what IOTL are Midway class ships, they are more for tradition than real serious need). Most of the carriers and big amphib platform spend their at sea time doing disaster relief or "good will". The Indians have three CVN, pretty much the same story, although the Indians have about half a dozen really advanced SSN with very deep diving capabilities.

Thanks, but what about China, what is their Military like?

 

[Tsar of New Zealand]

Thanks, but what about China, what is their Military like?

Numerous. Freakishly numerous. From what I gathered, North Korea on 'roids.

 

[CalBear]

Thanks, but what about China, what is their Military like?

Second tier with an utterly appalling, and entirely unsuspected, bio-weapons program. The Chinese program makes the Soviet program from OTL look like a Jr. High science project.

 

[CalBear]

How extensive/successful was the Nazi indoctrination of non Germans in Europe?

Were there Hitler Youth programs and the like in the Balkans and Western Europe?

Well, it sure as hell seemed to work in France.

It varied. The Hitler Youth as a group never spread much beyond pre-war Germany, Austria, and a small slice of the Sudetenland, but there were local versions, the most successful, by far, in Italy and France. The French Far Right was able to take some existing groups and run with them. This was helped by the Reich giving the French what looked, on the surface, to be independence with the Vichy government (critically, unlike IOTL the Vichy didn't have under three years to build itself up as the "real" government, but close to fourteen, most of which was in conditions where it seemed the WAllies had abandoned their one time ally, just as they had "abandoned" the Soviet Union). Other countries had the movements, but they were done by the numbers, with varying success in actually achieving true indoctrination.

 

[xxmagex]

With AANW becoming active again- Calbear, any plans to expand the TL past the epilogues you did taking the timeline up through 2018 IIRC?

 

[Wendigo]

With AANW becoming active again- Calbear, any plans to expand the TL past the epilogues you did taking the timeline up through 2018 IIRC?

The A4 vs WH40k

 

[Archangel]

Second tier with an utterly appalling, and entirely unsuspected, bio-weapons program. The Chinese program makes the Soviet program from OTL look like a Jr. High science project.

This suggests the next war, this time with TTL China, will involve global pandemics, nukes and orbital bombardment.

 

[Wendigo]

What makes China so bad ITTL?

What's their government like and how oppressive are they?

Are they as bad/worse than Mao?

 

[Teshuvah]

CalBear, what became of Mischling in the Reich?

Also, what happened to the Soviet PoWs that the Reich still had custody of after the USSR's surrender?

 

[Teshuvah]

What makes China so bad ITTL?

What's their government like and how oppressive are they?

Are they as bad/worse than Mao?

CalBear described them as OTL DPRK, but with a ruthlessly competent and sociopathic leadership.

 

[Theoretical_TJ]

Second tier with an utterly appalling, and entirely unsuspected, bio-weapons program. The Chinese program makes the Soviet program from OTL look like a Jr. High science project.

Well, won't that be an equalizer.

Is it a Samson option-type program, do they plan to announce it sometime, or is there some crazy-wicked mystery pandemic against the Capitalist West in the works?

 

[Wendigo]

CalBear, what became of Mischling in the Reich?

Also, what happened to the Soviet PoWs that the Reich still had custody of after the USSR's surrender?

Soviet POWs as with the majority of Slavs were worked to death.

Relevant excerpt:

Individuals were offered the opportunity to become “honorary Germans” who would eventually become fully accepted members of the Reich Volk or if very young, were simply stripped away from the families and sent to German to be raised by Party families (this was especially common with very young infants whose parents had the misfortune to not look German enough to be offered a place in Greater Germany). Individuals who turned down this offer were frequently selected for extermination through labor, where they joined a long list of undesirables including Polish and Soviet PoWs, Roma, Slavs, and especially Communists and other political prisoners.

 

[Wendigo]

Well, won't that be an equalizer.

Is it a Samson option-type program, do they plan to announce it sometime, or is there some crazy-wicked mystery pandemic against the Capitalist West in the works?

I want to know what's so special about the Chinese program that it makes the Soviet one look like a "Jr. High science project."

At its peak in the 1980s IOTL the Soviet Union had an ANNUAL production of the following agents:

1500 tons of Tularemia
4500 tons of Anthrax
150 tons of VEE
1500 tons of Plague
100 tons of Smallpox
2000 tons of Glanders
250 tons of Marburg

Source: https://books.google.com/books?id=ao62dIyD0KwC&pg=PT105&dq=soviet+union+anthrax+tons&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjMpc-wi5fOAhVpCpoKHX9BAE4Q6AEITjAJ#v=onepage&q=soviet union anthrax tons&f=false

 

[Constantinople]

Can you go into more detail about the state of Japan circa 2016?

It seems like with lots of help and time they should be getting ready for a super late Japanese miracle by now. The population is bound to be high and the US would have some interest in having a strong Japan in the face of whatever is going on in China.....

What is the population? Economy size? Do they have an emperor...?

 

[Wendigo]

Can you go into more detail about the state of Japan circa 2016?

It seems like with lots of help and time they should be getting ready for a super late Japanese miracle by now. The population is bound to be high and the US would have some interest in having a strong Japan in the face of whatever is going on in China.....

What is the population? Economy size? Do they have an emperor...?

Here are some relevant excerpts from CalBear about Japan in the 2000s:

Japan is making good progress, but its spot in the ATL world is mainly Brazil's with Argentina playing the part of Korea. Korea is well ahead of Japan, even with the destruction from the Intervention. Japan will make a recovery, but not quite the dramatic one of OTL.

Japan is up to Third World ALT 2011, actually better than most of the 3rd World. It started however, from a spot that makes 2011 Somalia look like Switzerland.

Japanese culture is utterly unrecognizable compared to OTL. Just the greatly increased number civilian fatalities ensured that. Japan was more or less one giant OTL Leningrad before the collapse. To say that the collective phyche of the Japanese people was destroyed is not an overstatement.

Significant number of Japanese survived to the surrender by doing things that were unspeakable. Many went to their graves, never having discussed what happened with anyone. Those who did were often shunned or said to be mad. Until the ATL 1990s, when the majority of those who had been old enough to remember what had taken place had begun to die in significant numbers, the most common medical condition in ATL Japan was Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. Imagine the culture of a country with 50 million long term psychiatric casualties.

Japan is pacifist, not just under its Constitution, but across the population. Japan's national psyche was completely destroyed by the war and by what those who survived the Burning Days had to do to in order to make it from one morning to the next. It will be at least a generation before the Japanese will even consider defending themselves.

 

[Wendigo]

How many nuclear weapons did the Allies actually use against the Reich and German forces in total?

How many slave laborers (both chattel serfs and those designated to be worked to death) were still alive when the Reich finally surrendered in 1960?

Was there any attempt to kill off remaining Slavs/other prisoners as the WAllies liberated territory in Germany/the General Government with death marches and the like as IOTL?

 

[Lowtuff]

Wow. Hadn't read though this TL in a while so went through it again. Doing so never fails to send a shiver down my spine. You did some amzing work, Calbear.

I'm looking forward to any future updates on the post war world as always, but in the meantime I thought I'd try my hand at some filler.

A lot of it is debatable, but hopefully it should be in the ballpark. Based off course off of BMunro's brilliant map of the TL.

 

[Lost Freeway]

Do they have an emperor...?

My money is on a republic. Given the sheer amount of suffering TTL Japan went through, the Chrysanthemum Throne might get caught up in the post-war backlash against the militarists.