What if Charles when he resigns gives his Burgundian lands to his brother instead of his son? In all likelihood the Netherlands will not revolt. Without the distractions in the Netherlands when the Ottomans invade Cyprus after winning the battle of Lepanto, Spanish forces reconquer Cyprus and by purchasing Crete from Venice an island string across the Mediterranean is established.
Ferdinand inherits the Netherlands
- Thread starter Musketeer513
- Start date
Wouldn't they? They didn't revolt because Philip was Spanish, they revolted because they weren't allowed to be protestant and because the Spanish wanted to take away Dutch autonomy. Wether Spanish or Austrian, the Dutch will go protestant. This could still cause a conflict with the Austrian Habsburgs. And if the Austrians would leave the Dutch alone, I suspect that within decades all of the Dutch speaking Netherlands and a significantly portion of the Walloon Netherlands would be Calvinist. It was a conversion from the bottom up, not top down.It was truly the people, the common people who converted and manage to take over in the cities.
I have to dissagree here. The religious situation at the beginning of the dutch revolt is that the majority of the population was undecided in it's religion. There wasn't a yet an all clear distinction between what was considered calvinist and catholic and most believers followed someone they considered an authorithy in this. F.i. in the village Lexmond (ZH), there was a catholic priest who around 1600 broke with the bishop, switched to the protestant believe and as a consequence his successor was also calvinist, this time educated in Leiden. The population in Lexmond became as a consequence also calvinistic. In another village Hagestein not far from there, the priest remained catholic, when he died the Kapitel van Oud Muster in Utrecht appointed a calvinist successor for the parish, but that person switched back to the catholic faith and as a consequence Hagestein remained mainly catholic
Another example of the fluidity of religion is a priest in Houten(UT), who asked around the same time his parishioners in which rites they wanted their children baptized, the calvinist or the catholic.
One of the main factors to determine if a region stays catholic or switched to calvinist is a succesfull implementation of the reforms of the council of Trent. And specifically the appointment of seminary educated priests in the parishes. This failed in the Republic for obvious reasons and even there there remained strong catholic enclaves in the countryside, like in the area above Alkmaar and Volendam. These enclaves have been explained as a consequence of the allowance by the local ruler of (missionairy) activities by the catholic church in the early 17th century. This principle also explains why Brabant and the Achterhoek remained catholic even after conquest by the Republic.
This all makes me believe that a Netherlands not afflicted by revolt would slowly be turned catholic, just like f.i. Poland, where the counter Reformation was also succesfull in reconverting.
Koprulu Mustafa Pasha
Gone Fishin'
1. Why would Spain suddenly reconquer Cyprus? OTL the Ottoman Fleet after Lepanto was destroyed but nobody really tried to invade Cyprus.
2. Why would Venice sell Crete to Spain? There is no need for that in the 16th century.
The Netherlands will not revolt if 1. Centralization is not happening, 2. No raise of taxes on trade and 3. No opressive religious laws
Ferdinand won't do it but a type like Ferdinand II in the early 17th Century is a type to do it which delays such revolt. Considering the border with France the Austrians will have a harder time. But the income of the Lowlands might be just enough to cope with that.
If no ultra Catholic Ferdinand II takes power and the Austrians hold on to their realm then Austria might bring the HRE Closer together. Spain is better off. Only to concentrate on France and North Africa.
Should Ferdinand divide his realms as he did otl, it could be another boon. A locally raised monarch or at least one who would be trained by Mary of Hungary and their great aunt before her would be helpful.
Well, only son who's old enough for that is Archduke Ferdinand II. He'd be in single digits when Marge dies, but at least he'd be under Marie's tutelage for a good while. Marie left for Spain with Eleonore and Karl V IIRC, by which time Ferdinand Junior will be in his mid-20s, having spent a good portion of those 2 decades in Brussels with his aunt as teacher. Hell, to the English (assuming things go as OTL and we wind up with Mary and then Elizabeth Tudor) he might be considered a more appealing groom than Felipe II (Liz WAS offered to him - and his widowed father - during her siblings' reign IIRC)
Well Ferdinand getting Netherlands is impossible after Mary Tudor became Queen of England as Netherlands were given then to Philip and destined to his eventual children by Mary so you need to butterfly Mary’s reign and her wedding to Philip and then have Charles V deciding to left Netherlands to his own daughter Mary and not to Philip. In alternative Netherlands can go (or being destined) to Charles’ daughter Mary as part of her dowry