Alternative History Armoured Fighting Vehicles Part 3

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OK so lets change the scenario, what if it was an ISOT, you have some modern military equipment and a museum or say a private collection of military vehicles.
You find that you have a decent number of Jagdpanzer. IV's and Pz.IV's (early war, mid war and late war models) and Pz.IV variants around such as Hummels, Wirbelwinds, Ostwinds and so forth, I imagine some parts can be scavenged from the various variants to keep the Jagdpanzer IV's running for a while.

You also have a very hostile enemy nearby with say early WWII era equipment (1939-1941 tech), they can't manufacture their equipment, its all been purchased from other countries and they've all been ISOTed away as well.
What would you do?
 
Given you can get most likely a couple of beater T-54/55s at that price its a far better trade.
Well, if you're going to sell them you might as well sell them for something good: here's a T-72 for 200k euros or about 250k. If you can get a million bucks for a Jagdpanzer IV, then selling all four gets you sixteen T-72s which'd be a serious upgrade. Alas there's been a bit of a price hike lately, as I remember them selling the things for $50k only a few years back. That'd have let you get a lot of T-72s straight from the bargain bin.

Good luck filing for the paperwork to get them all shipped out of the EU to an active war zone, though :p
 
OK so lets change the scenario, what if it was an ISOT, you have some modern military equipment and a museum or say a private collection of military vehicles.
You find that you have a decent number of Jagdpanzer. IV's and Pz.IV's (early war, mid war and late war models) and Pz.IV variants around such as Hummels, Wirbelwinds, Ostwinds and so forth, I imagine some parts can be scavenged from the various variants to keep the Jagdpanzer IV's running for a while.

You also have a very hostile enemy nearby with say early WWII era equipment (1939-1941 tech), they can't manufacture their equipment, its all been purchased from other countries and they've all been ISOTed away as well.
What would you do?
It depends on what the hell I was trying to do. If I was fighting for my life, I would say forget the museum/private collection stuff and haul ass in the modern equipment to the point I can sell it to the Western Allies.

If behind Western Allied lines use it as tech guides to help the war effort
 
Well, if you're going to sell them you might as well sell them for something good: here's a T-72 for 200k euros or about 250k. If you can get a million bucks for a Jagdpanzer IV, then selling all four gets you sixteen T-72s which'd be a serious upgrade. Alas there's been a bit of a price hike lately, as I remember them selling the things for $50k only a few years back. That'd have let you get a lot of T-72s straight from the bargain bin.

Good luck filing for the paperwork to get them all shipped out of the EU to an active war zone, though :p
Given the UK isn't in the EU anymore or the fact Kevin Wheatcroft has more money than anyone has a right to have, I'm sure he can deal with the paperwork with fat stacks of money.
 
It depends on what the hell I was trying to do. If I was fighting for my life, I would say forget the museum/private collection stuff and haul ass in the modern equipment to the point I can sell it to the Western Allies.

If behind Western Allied lines use it as tech guides to help the war effort
OK lets say that you and a small section of land and a foreign aggressive group of people have been ISOT to lets say an Island in some unspecified time and its a matter of kill or be killed.
 
I would say that if you for whatever reasons cant get complete vehichles and only components, the first things to modernize are the engines and FCS
 
So assuming WW2 doesn't happen, how does this impact Czechoslovakian tank design/production?

Did Czechoslovakia have the economic ability to sustain native tank production for the long term?
 
So assuming WW2 doesn't happen, how does this impact Czechoslovakian tank design/production?

Did Czechoslovakia have the economic ability to sustain native tank production for the long term?
On World of Tanks there are several Skoda designs with a heavy T-34 influence but if we butterfly WWII and Nazi Germany I think Skoda might have been influenced by the Swedish Strv tank designs so here's what I think the tank that would have followed the LTvz.38 might have looked like.
LT vz 42.png

I gave it the Hetzer's suspension but with an extra roadwheel added, the engine deck from an Strv M-42, a Pz-ish turret made from the Italian P26/40 armed with a KwK. 39 5cm. cannon.
I imagine the Czechs adopting a tank along these lines around 1944-45 in a timeline where there is no major war in Europe in the first half the of the 1940's.
I call this one the ST vz.42 for the year it might have been designed.
 
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I hope everyone in here is having a good start to a new year! :D

Now, getting to business, I've found out something actually rather interesting about the Jagdpanzer IV. Quote from Tank Encyclopedia:


Here's a picture of a Jagdpanzer IV in Syrian service:

7w711H3.jpg


And someone made a really good model of the thing here, but that's not what I want to mention, instead, what I want to talk about is how these tanks were apparently still in the arsenal of Syria at least into the 90s, with some unconfirmed mentions on the internet about them actually still being in service as late as 2009...and that makes me wonder. Let's say you are an officer of a cash strapped Middle Eastern army that has just ended up in a civil war or what have you at the start of the 2010s and you don't have that many vehicles to choose from, so you've got to use the Jagdpanzer and get it into at least a usable condition. It might be horrifically outmatched when compared to a modern tank or anything like that, but as an armored box to lob shells at dugin infantry from far away it probably still works fine.

That said, what could be done to give this seventy year old hull even a snowball's chance of being useful? Logically you'd want to replace the gun (and hull MG), as I can't imagine you'd be able to find that many 7.5cm shells just lying around nowadays and you might have a more modern tank that's too badly damaged to be repaired which might be able to serve as a donor for a main weapon, but what about protection and other areas? I can imagine welding on some kind of slat armor to the frontal arc and maybe to the sides to give a little protection against shaped charge attacks (ie, an RPG) and maybe something like an ATGM launcher could be affixed to the commander's hatch atop a pintle mount similar to the way the launcher is fit onto a BMP just in case the poor sods inside happen to be unfortunate enough to encounter something like, say, a T-54 or Type 59 that'd otherwise make quick work of the thing. It'd probably help to give someone a pair of night vision goggles, too :p

Alternatively, would it be better to try and improvise the thing into a kind of SPG like the Panzer IVs that became Hummels? Cut off the roof of the hull and convert it into a sort of Jagdpanzer-Hummel hybrid? I can scarcely even imagine what that thing would look like, but apparently both the D-1 (152mm) and D-30 (122mm) are common enough in the Middle East so they could potentially be put used as a main weapon without too many concerns about ammo, so it should be possible to convert the thing into a poor man's SPG.

I know it is a pretty implausible thing, but thoughts? It makes a decent mental exercise if nothing else :p
I'd sell it to a rich Western or Russian militaria collector for restoration and use the proceeds to buy T-55s.

But if that's not an option, I'd replace the engine with a Soviet diesel (easier to get parts for) and the gun with a big-bore howitzer for infantry support (since a long-barrel 75 mm isn't going to be good for antitank stuff anymore). The Egyptians mounted D-30 guns on T-34s without losing the turrets--in a turretless design, you could probably do the same with even less difficulty. As you say, antitank missiles are a must.
 
On World of Tanks there are several Skoda designs with a heavy T-34 influence but if we butterfly WWII and Nazi Germany I think Skoda might have been influenced by the Swedish Strv tank designs so here's what I think the tank that would have followed the LTvz.38 might have looked like.
View attachment 614329
I gave it the Hetzer's suspension but with an extra roadwheel added, the engine deck from an Strv M-42, a Pz-ish turret made from the Italian P26/40 armed with a KwK. 39 5cm. cannon.
I imagine the Czechs adopting a tank along these lines around 1944-45 in a timeline where there is no major war in Europe in the first half the of the 1940's.
I call this one the LT vz.42 for the year it might have been designed.
Why LT - lahky tank (light tank)? Would’ve this be ST-42 - stredny tank (medium tank)?
 
Saw this the other day in Reddit. It looks like a Panther turret on a Tiger. Anyone have any ideas about how this came about. If this had happened I believe it would have been better against tanks than the standard Tiger but less useful supporting infantry due to the small HE shell.
 

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Saw this the other day in Reddit. It looks like a Panther turret on a Tiger. Anyone have any ideas about how this came about. If this had happened I believe it would have been better against tanks than the standard Tiger but less useful supporting infantry due to the small HE shell.

Sorry, but it never did come about. Here's the original unphotoshopped picture:
3CHI13w.jpg
 
Panther.jpg

A Panther ausf.D in Israeli markings part of the German reparations and assistance package to Israel sponsored by the Rommel government in 1946.*

*Inspired by the short story "Rommel vs Zhukov - Decision in the East 1944-45" by Peter G. Tsouras
 
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